Great post, Bodvar, as usual.
The issue underneath here is chronology, in the historical sense. These Jewish kosher laws come out of 14-15 century B.C., (conservative dating of the Torah). This is hard to top.
My first paper I presented at the Iranian Studies Conference (Bethesda, MD), 2000, was on Zoroaster and the Jews. There were Jews in Iran as early as 722 BC, maybe even 730, following the Assyrian captivities and explusions. Scholars say Zoroaster came in the next century. Therefore, my theory is he borrowed from the Jewish concepts.
But the point is, we mustn't confuse writing with oral tradition, either, as you hinted. But oral tradition is untracable. In other words, it is impossible to get to the origins of an oral tradition itself, or to date is exactly.
Jung tried to look for archetypes in culture. There may be something to this. But, linguists say language began suddenly, and was apparently one language in the beginning. What do you think?
That means everyone knew everything at one time, and then it all diversified, modified, separated, etc., fragmented...as the race divided.
I don't think the Jews invented anything. I think "ultimate" truth is only and ever INHERITED, never created or invented. All I'm saying is, historically, modern western cultural hygien is based on Judeo-Christian concepts, and much more Judeo than Christian....
Who got what from where, when, BEFORE THAT, is actually quite a different issue.
Posted by David Yeagley at May 6, 2003 10:30 AMI'm surprised that this topic hasn't gotten notice, having mentioned Jews prominently. Usually, folks have an opinion in blogs when the "J-word" is mentioned.
I hardly think that the Jews are in the vanguard on this one.
I think, perhaps, that our rabbinic brothers have preserved for us the BEST DOCUMENTED case of ritual purity, but I'd bet that several Hindu sects, the Zoroastarians, and many in Europe, before and after the Christian interval, could give them a run for their money.
Let us not confuse being able to write and preserve what you write with being able to think.
There were plenty of pre-literate societies which we only today are finding to be as profound and developed as anything laid down on paper. Pre-Christian Iceland and Germany were seats of oral literature and an intricate artistic and intellectual life. Let us not forget, as well, all our Native American brothers, who came to the pen late.
The Jews, as well as a stringent rules on ritual cleanliness, had and have dietary laws which would do any Jain or Brahmin proud. They aren't unique in their...er..."anality" where cleanliness is involved...and, I doubt that microbes have anything to do with it.
Cleanliness is a BIG cultural hurdle, worldwide, the more regulated the society or sect becomes. They ALSO have rather stringent rules about menstruating women, yeast, and the care of holy documents, as well, none of which have anything to do with physical health, per se.
But, if I'm not mistaken, the Lakota had a thing about menstruating women, as well. Many peoples around the globe mandated ritual bathing or scenting themselves prior to addressing their Gods.
There's a sect in India (Parsis, I believe) have death houses set aside for the decomposition of their dead, as they believe the human body to be corruption and filth, and they don't want to "pollute" holy substances (i.e., fire, water or earth), so no cremation or inhumation or even burial at sea.
Personally, as a Norseman, I tend to look with gimlet eyes at anyone who would deny themselves pork -- our usual Yuletide feast centerpiece -- and, as a redneck, wonder at anyone who'd deny themselves bacon.
Maybe, by avoiding port, the blood in their arteries moves along at a quicker clip, but it's a high price to pay.
-- B
Posted by Bodvar at May 5, 2003 11:09 PM