David Yeagley is the great-great-grandson of Comanche leader Bad Eagle. 
Whoever created the part for the Irishman “Stephen” in Brave Heart (1995), and cast David O’Hara in the part, must have known the secret of Irish charm and its irresistible uniqueness. The Scots thought he was mad, at first, but he proved himself right in all things. Reminds us of an Irish “Tonto,” he does. Stephen certainly represents that eternal independence from the English.
David O’Hara (ironically, Scottish), as the Irishman,
“Stephen,” in Brave Heart. Who knows, maybe his blood
is Irish, just born in Scotland.
Stephen also represents the magical notions of God, or, the nature of Irish religious sentiments. He talks to the Lord above as though He were a personal companion. The simplicity of belief transcends ritual or formality. It is the glory of the personal, not the public God.
Yet, the Celtic Irish took to the Catholic form of Christianity. Saint Patrick , though Welsh, came to the Isles in the early 5th Century AD as a Christian missionary, and along with Brigid of Kildare and Colmcille, is considered the patron saint of the Irish. Interestingly, however, the Virgin Mary cult did not make the top tier as it did elsewhere.
The Irish always resented domination by the English, naturally. The Irish were clannish, tribal, and could be vicious. These Celts are said to have come to the islands in the Iron Age, between the 8th and 1st century BC. The Gaels were the last wave of “immigrants.” We don’t know who exactly were the indigenous were. The Irish are similar to the American Indian, in that there were simply the known firsts. Their legends gave to account of any other people before them.
In latter times, the English took advantage of the Irish Catholic/Irish Protestant divide (if not having created it), and then the natural brutalities commenced. In the 1840′s, the most terrible famine forced over a million Irishmen to immigrate to America, leaving another million of their dead behind. By 1850, half of all immigration to the United States was from Ireland.
Hollywood has recently aggrandized the social problems among the Irish in America. Movies like Gangs of New York (2002) tell a gruesome story. The 20th century chapter of the story, of course, is the Irish Mafia, producing such well-known American idols as the Joe Kennedy and sons, John Fitzgerald and Robert Francis, and the interminably offensive Edward Moore (“Ted”).
So the Irish came in miserable hordes of poor, ignorant, and filthy. They were stuffed in mass housing of “plodding uniformity,” as Nathaniel Hawthorne would say, with no consideration but for their proximity to the factories in which they worked. (Yet, in some cases, there was such prejudice against them that there were actually laws that forbid the hiring of “red-headed Irishmen.”) The industrial revolution in America would never have happened without the Irish. They drank incessantly, they worked endlessly, and were all Catholic, and voted Democrat.
In due time, however, foreigners who come to this country are blessed. The Irish were once slave labor in American factories. Today, they own the factories. They own the whole industries.
In 1991, I was living in Andover, Massachusetts, teaching piano. I was also developing a social theory, and doing much research. I went to the Andover public library to look for the wealthiest companies in America, with CEO’s who might be interested in social theory. (I was looking for support of my theory, of course.) I found two very large, dark-blue volumes of all the major corporations in America. I was taken by surprise to find that three out of five of the largest corporations of the country were run by Irishmen! McIntosh, McDowell, McGinn, etc. It was striking. (The other two of the five were first German, then finally some Anglo-Saxon names.) That discovery made an indelible impression on me. (That night I had the worst migraine headache in history, and worried that I would not see morning. Totally unrelated to my research, of course, other than perhaps the overworking of my eyes.)
Sons of the Irish ganster, Joe Kennedy.
And today our leading newsmen, the ‘keepers of the gates,’ are Irish Catholic. As we pointed out, whether Left (Chris Mathews) or Right (Bill O’Reilly), the Irish have risen to the top in media. They have become a leading force in America, from the guttermost to the uttermost.
And now we have another Irishman running for president, and he recently decided to become Catholic: Newt Gingrich. With our six Catholics on the Supreme Court, (including Sotomayor–who is in all likelihood a cryptic Jew), and the swing vote being an Irish Catholic (Anthony M. Kennedy), America might stop and consider its own history. America was created by White Anglo-Saxon Protestants. The Irish were a add-on. This is not an Irish Catholic country, although it may appear to have evolved into such.
The Celts of Ireland were never able to rid themselves of the dominant Anglos on the Islands. They were always held a wee bit under. But, in America, it looks as though the Irish revenge is having its day. The day is at hand when the Irish Catholic will dominate the entire society, occupying all the seats of power, social and political. They will have finally whipped the English.
The Leprichan looms. The pot of gold is before them, as never before. BadEagle.com has written about red hair, and the rise of the Catholicism in America before. There are obvious political concerns, indeed. Yet, the charm of the Irish is still active. Even without the Virgin Mary, the Emerald Isle in America has emerged anew, and greatly enlarged her shores.
The white race has its inner combat, indeed. So why in the world do the whites feel so desperate to not be judged as prejudice toward any other race? If the great white tribes can battle it out amongst themselves for centuries, why this sudden suicidal self-righteousness in the way of race pandering toward the darkies? That’s a bit much, isn’t it?
The White Anglo-Saxons protestants were not born on top of the world. They earned their place. But they’re sure quick to step down. Why?
24 responses so far ↓
1 KO // Dec 1, 2011 at 5:30 pm
Why are WASPs so quick to step down? They lack solidarity as a result of diversity and mobility. As a result they are always ready to find non-WASP allies to beat each other down. Look at the difficulty the colonies had in working together in the Revolutionary War. Look how divided colonial society was by the Revolution. Then when new immigrants started pouring in, rather than unite to limit the influx, the WASPs fled. New England became New Ireland in the first episode of White Flight. And we’ve been flying ever since, giving up the cities and then the inner ring suburbs, and next… I know it is a huge source of frustration for you that the only peoples the whites have been able to unite against were the Indians. Contrast that with the inability to unite regarding blacks.
Sorry to get off the track of your Irish theme, but your last question is an important one. Lack of solidarity and mobility (which are both manifestations of Protestant individualism) made the Anglo-Saxons the most successful early practitioners of industrial capitalism, but also disabled them from protecting their societies from both external and internal threats. Irish have maintained a slight amount of solidarity in opposition to WASPs, when it is convenient to observe it, but on the whole are totally assimilated to WASP non-civilization.
2 David Yeagley // Dec 1, 2011 at 8:44 pm
KO, powerful statements. Many thanks!
3 WHEELER // Dec 2, 2011 at 9:11 am
I agree with KO. The same thing happening here in America is happening in Britain.
The English, Anglo-Saxon, Normans, are not a cohesive racial unit. They may be defective in this regard. The Angles and Saxons are two Germanic tribes that intermarried. They did not even keep separate. So the problem began there. Where as the American Indian stayed in separate tribes and acted clannishly without combining, (as far as I can tell), Northern European peoples are different.
Also, God blesses His people. God said, “He who honors me, I will honor, and he who dishonors me, I will dishonor”. There is a spiritual side as well. Britain rejected God’s authority here on earth. Maybe they go the way of the Dodo bird.
4 WHEELER // Dec 2, 2011 at 9:13 am
OT, Have you read Plato at all Dr. Yeagley? Plato is central to Western Culture. Take some leisurely time and read it.
5 REG // Dec 2, 2011 at 9:36 am
Not just in the US, there are many Irish in Australia and Mexico. There is a book called “How the Irish saved civilization” by Thomas Cahill. It describes how the Irish changed from Viking pagans to Christians. For over two hundred years they had their own church, more like the Jews than Roman Catholics. However, they merged with the RC and retained many of their original beliefs. However, they were not able to preserve everything. It was the fact that the Irish visited the declining Roman Empire and brought the libraries to Ireland that provided Europe with the “Enlightenment” when the printing press was invented. Irish Monks turned copies of the libraries over to colleges. Personally, I wonder if we might have done better without the ‘wisdom of the ancient Greeks and Romans.’ The Irish were never ignorant. The Irish always prized learning and amazed people with the fact that they were barefoot and tattered; but, could read and write better than many more affluent. That was one of the reasons we concurred this country from within. We had the knowledge, we only needed opportunity. The English gained control because the Pope gave Ireland to England to manage while England was Catholic. Then the Protestants took over England and the battles began because the Protestants wanted to impose Calvinism on the Irish. Not the religion but the concept of authority that is inherit in Calvinism. ie the devine right of kings concept. The only way to win that fight was for forceful deportation and English from the Cumberland Gap in North England were promised land in Ireland if they would remain loyal to England (Orange). Irish were scooped out of North Ireland and dumped in North England to fend for themselves to make room for the English in Ireland. England could have saved a lot of trouble, if they hadn’t tried to lord it over the Irish. The Irish have been considered the bane of American society but it wasn’t them, it was the massive German Communist immigration that came in at the same time after losing their wars in East Europe that changed our politics.
6 Pamela K. // Dec 2, 2011 at 10:18 am
At the founding of this great nation, America’s wealth, unlike the long established societies and kingdoms in Europe, was primarily the land, and the vast amounts of untapped resources beneath our soil, as well as the highly lucrative fur trade.
From the first stirrings of independence, there were many rumors of plots to usurp power and authority and to undermine the vision of America as a nation free from the stifling influence of tyrannical European despotism.
Wading into the fray of plots and conspiracies was the Irish- born, French-educated Thomas Conway. After being made a Brigadier General in the Continental Army, Conway criticized General George Washington’s leadership as Commander. It seems Conway wanted to be promoted to general himself, and Washington opposed him because he felt that there were more American-born soldiers deserving of this honor.
Conway believed that Washington was an ineffectual and weak leader and advocated for him to be replaced by General Horatio Gates.
To say that “the pen is mightier than the sword” is an understatement in his case. Conway wrote a letter of criticisms against Washington to Gates which was later intercepted from Secretary of War James Wilkinson, (said to be a fellow conspirator in what came to be known as “Conway’s Cabal”) by Washington and his supporters, and taken before the Congress for inquiry. When the contents of the letter were made public, Conway lost his command as Brigadier-General and later submitted his resignation to Congress in March, 1788. He later returned to the French Army and served as a governor of the French colonies in India.
Conway’s treachery against Washington leads me to believe that he may well have been in the employ of the French government all along. It seems to me he cared more about obtaining power for himself than fighting to keep America free and independent from foreign influence.
During the time of Conway’s Cabal, while the new American nation was fighting to maintain independence, both France and Spain, were battling it out for control of the lands west of the Missouri and Mississippi Rivers, and both of them were battling England, which sought to retain control over the entire continent. Meanwhile, caught up between the warring factions were the many Indian tribes, some cooperating with the white men that came paddling up the rivers in search of gold and beaver pelts, and who established trading posts to conduct business with them, while other tribes opposed their intrusion, and rightly so, especially after these strangers’ pillaging of the natural resources of the land, which these tribes
depended on, began to drastically effect the survival of their own people.
7 David Yeagley // Dec 2, 2011 at 12:51 pm
Wheeler, you tempt me. I have five degrees, including a doctorate, in literature and the fine arts. You don’t think I have read Plato? Ah, you haven’t really read BadEagle.com. Many articles involved classical Greek authors and culture…
But, my real question for you is–do you consider that God has an authority on earth? What might that be? What is its authority? over whom, over what?
8 WHEELER // Dec 2, 2011 at 1:20 pm
I’m sorry Dr. Plato had wonderful discourses on the soul and its immortality. I was trying to help you see metaphysically. To try to see the “beyond”.
God does have authority on earth and it is called Bishops. All the bishops have the authority of God. Jesus gave it to them. “Whatever you bound on earth will be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven”. They are the caretakers of the Faith. It is called “The Deposit of Faith” They are to guard it and then it is passed from one generation after another. The Authority of the Bishop comes from Christ himself. Read St. Justin the Martyr. All Christians are subject to the local bishop.
——
On another note I found this, that might help you understand:
For Oriental Orthodox Christianity the Gospel According to John is the canon within the canon. Jesus’ bringing eternal life (something human beings have never had but dearly desire) makes possible the “divinization” of Christians. The image of Jesus as the God incarnate who brings eternal life to earth is central to Orthodox theology. The devotional icon of this Christianity is not the crucifix. It is the Mother of God with the incarnate God in her bosom. It was in the incarnation that redemption became actualized for those who believe in Him. This is the theme of the whole Gospel According to John, and I am identifying this at the beginning because if one does not know what it is about it is impossible to interpret it.
Found at:
http://spectrummagazine.org/article/column/2011/06/10/beginning-was-logos?quicktabs_2=1
Hopefully that helps you understand the importance of the BVM.
9 David Yeagley // Dec 2, 2011 at 1:32 pm
This is properly called “theory,” not “faith.” Essentially different. This is idolizing ideas, not believing and acting on trust.
If you insist on asserting that I am ignorant, and that you are educated, I shan’t attempt further to enlighten you.
You have invested in ideas, in theory, in tradition. I have not. God is alive, simple, and personal, or I cannot relate to Him.
And, I’m sorry to say, but Spectrum Magazine represents heretical Adventism, or, those trying to associate themselves with academic thought, rather than faith.
Faith is naked. It can’t be clothed. All such attempts are the weaving of human thought.
A rabbi I studied with once taught that truth was an experience, not a proposition. i agree with that. Now, it does not follow that the experience of adhering to an idea or theory comprises faith…
10 David Yeagley // Dec 2, 2011 at 1:44 pm
There are no “Palestinians.” There is no “Mary.” There is no soul, no intelligent entity placed into the body and capable of existence apart therefrom.
There were fire-breathing dragons which lived in the sea (Job. 41:19-21; 31,32); there were Jewish martial arts experts who could kill hundreds of opponents in one encounter (II Samuel 23: 8, f.); there was a Man who was resurrected from the grave who had a body of flesh and bone, and who ate fish (John 20:27; 21:9,12).
I believe things. I have no embarrassment at dimensional irrationality. But I feel no obligation to believe other men’s thoughts. I choose what I want to believe.
I believe I am free to choose. I feel that I choose.
Belief is not the verdict of logic, or the compulsion of evidence. Belief is an act of the will. A free act.
11 KO // Dec 2, 2011 at 2:35 pm
Agreed, Wheeler, the Angles and Saxons were probably hostile rivals in the patchwork of North German tribes. They intermarried in Briton, as you say. But they both also intermarried with the Celtic Britons. Then there were the Normans and any number of Dutch and French immigrants. That didn’t stop the English, as far as I know, from showing a high level of solidarity against Napoleon and a century later against the Prussians. We haven’t had external enemies to unite us by issuing a focused threat against our national survival. Instead we are still fighting civil wars between Jeffersonians and Hamiltonians.
Reg, Thomas Sowell’s Ethnic America is a delightful book with an interesting chapter on the contribution of the Irish to America. Like you he emphasizes their literacy. Good chapter on the Germans, too.
Thanks for your comment, Dr. Yeagley. I hope something will prove me wrong. For example, if Tea Partiers and OWS-types realized that they need to unite against the Big-Government-Big-Business-Big-Labor Oligarchy, enforce the checks and balances the founders bequeathed to us with respect to Big Government, and impose checks and balances on Big Business and Big Labor, the need for which the founders could not imagine in 1787. Instead, the progressives thought they could use Big Government to counterbalance Big Business, but the result is just a more oppressive combination.
12 zephyr // Dec 2, 2011 at 3:33 pm
KO: “if Tea Partiers and OWS-types realized that they need to unite against the Big-Government-Big-Business-Big-Labor Oligarchy, enforce the checks and balances the founders bequeathed to us with respect to Big Government, and impose checks and balances on Big Business and Big Labor . . .”
Interesting thought, but the likelihood of OWS and TPP people uniting is nil.
The Tea Party is not about imposing anything on business–Tea Party groups support free market capitalism, which is why we eschew government control. We also do NOT support unions, but push for right-to-work in states that don’t recognize that as a right.
OWS protestors, though clearly not terribly unified, oppose Wall Street (apparently not realizing Obama and Soros’ own connections to same). They also tend to support big government (socialism)–another thing that Tea Partiers loathe.
Greed is common to all humans, rich and poor alike. Not our best trait, and from a spiritual perspective, often leads to sin, as does envy. But the spiritual realm is God’s domain to judge, not man’s.
Consequently, neither greed nor envy–in and of themselves–should be legally classified as criminal.
Crimes must be defined as actions. Dealing with thoughts and attitudes is God’s domain.
Certainly greed, envy, lust, pride, etc sometimes lead to actions that damage others. When those actions take rights away from others, then crime has been committed.
Churchill was right–socialism is the “gospel of envy”, which is one of the principle reasons why true Christians oppose it. God declares envy a sin, whether it’s a Wall Street banker or a Wall Street occupier. But our society–as immoral as it is–is not equipped to make those judgments on a legal basis. God will take care of the spiritual ones.
13 zephyr // Dec 2, 2011 at 3:36 pm
OWS protestors also distinguish themselves by their lack of knowledge of history and the Constitution. Tea Party people support the Constitution 100%, precisely because it limits government interference in our lives.
14 KO // Dec 2, 2011 at 3:55 pm
Zephyr, I agree, if I may paraphrase, that OWSers are socialist idiots. They think socialism is the answer to our problems, but we already have blanket control of production and social life by political powers and pressures. That is, we already have socialism. This is as good as socialism gets. Favoritism and unemployment are inherent to it. The only way OWS socialists can be of any use is when they see that Big Government, in cahoots with Big Business and Big Labor, is the main reason we are facing the difficulties we are facing. Then they can ally with Tea Partiers, who should realize that Big Business and Big Labor have been screwing them with job export and mass immigration and need to be controlled as much as Big Government does.
Refusal to exercise economic nationalism results from lack of solidarity and diversity. Just what I was talking about above.
15 KO // Dec 2, 2011 at 4:05 pm
To return to Prf. Yeagley’s question, “Anyone concerned?” I’m concerned because of the Irish history of siding with the Democrats and the Left based on the now purely imaginary oppression of the WASP establishment. Some Irish are given to making themselves feel good by taking the liberal high road of favoring blacks, Mexicans, oppressed women, oppressed workerrs, high taxes, etc., etc., remembering their poor ancestors, tears in their eyes. How could I keep one refugee out of America, when my ancestors came here as immigrants 200 years ago? But in saying this I am saying no more than that Irish Americans have their own set of excuses for succumbing to liberalism, just as every other demographic does. If we’re not going to proscribe everyone but WASP males and Dr. Yeagley, we’re just going to have to keep living with liberals and convert them one at a time.
16 David Yeagley // Dec 2, 2011 at 10:03 pm
Why is the character of OWS and character of the TPs so utterly contrasted? Why is their behavior, as a “group,” so completely opposite in nature?
Either their “common denominator” is essentially opposite, and only illusively similar, or, even in the abstract (as in “protest”), they are impossibly dissimilar and even opposed to each other.
And, the earlier immigrant groups do always fee obligated to be liberal to others, but, after the WASP bowed out, it does seem to be one perpetual pity party, with competition for hosts. The Negroes claim corner on pity, but different white groups have tried to demonstrate more pity than others. Democrat liberal Communists seem to win the position of host to pity, but, Republicans are really pretty good at it, too. But, their main concern is that they not be judged prejudice or racist, and that’s an image thing, so, they’re often unconvincing to the pity contestants…
17 frinkle // Dec 3, 2011 at 2:44 am
Was the rule against hiring red haired irishman literally applied to only people with red hair? I know that historically there has been a stereotype that people with red hair have fiery tempers. And if it was applied to only people with red hair I wonder if non-irish with red hair were also not hired.
18 Pamela K. // Dec 3, 2011 at 9:02 am
I’m not sure about any rule against hiring red- haired people of Irish descent, but I once saw an old sign in an antique store that read, “Irish Need Not Apply”.
From the late nineteenth and most of the early twentieth century, the working-class Irish were the low men and women on the societal ladder, only a rung higher than the working class Italians.
In the big cities across America, the Italian immigrant neighborhoods were often unwillingly intimidated and harassed by an extortion racket known as La Mano Nera, or the Black Hand. Although they had a habit of targeting successful Italians, which included the famous tenor Enrico Caruso, many average Italians lived in fear of incurring the wrath of this widespread criminal enterprise, the roots of which come from southern Italy. An active branch of La Mano Nera once thrived in Scranton, Pennsylvania, the hometown of my paternal Italian grandparents.
The Black Hand, as well as the Mafia, often hired the Irish to be the enforcers of the implied threats against people who refused to cooperate with them, or who double-crossed them.
The Irish were/are well known for their cunning and ruthlessness in mob warfare, as in the true story of “The Irishman” Danny Greene, a working class thug from Cleveland, recruited to work for the Mafia in the 1970′s.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GbOLyQ19xa8&feature=related
19 Greg H // Dec 3, 2011 at 8:32 pm
I would like to recommend a great book by T.J. English titled “The Westies: Inside New Yorks Irish Mob”. I read it years ago and it is very good look into the Irish gang controlled by Jimmy Coonan. They were ruthless. Also the documentary The Irish in America from the History channel is pretty decent as well. Dr, Yeagley, I had never linked the Irish in America to big government as having anything to do with the RCC. I believe you are right. Thank you for the information.
20 WHEELER // Dec 4, 2011 at 1:54 pm
“”If you insist on asserting that I am ignorant, and that you are educated, I shan’t attempt further to enlighten you.”"”
That wasn’t my intention whatsoever. Metaphysics is not easy for a lot of people. Plato talked a lot about the use of the “Mind’s Eye”. Metaphysics is abstract thought about being. The soul is based in metaphysics. It has nothing to do with education, it is transcendent thinking. A lot of people don’t have this.
“”"You have invested in ideas, in theory, in tradition. I have not. God is alive, simple, and personal, or I cannot relate to Him.”"”
In your statement, it is personal. The Faith is very subjective. All the points I made, is objective. These are the teachings of the Church. The Church was created in a Greek milieu. Alexander the Great conquered the whole area and brought the Greek language everywhere. The Old Testament was translated into Greek called the Septuagint. This is the cultural milieu. Even at Rome, the language was Greek. With the Greek language comes Greek concepts.
This is the plan of God.
Christianity enculturated Hellenism. Plato is in a sense the co-creator of Christianity. The New Testament is in Greek. Christianity grew up in Alexanderia, Antioch, Corinth, Ephesus.
The Faith is not subjective, but objective. Mary as living is an objective reality. God created that reality, not us. If you say, this is my personal opinion, and that there is no “Mary” then you are saying that you are God and that you determine the Faith. The Blessed Virgin Mary exists despite all the private opinion out there. It is not up to us.
If you want to approach God in your own way, that is fine but you can’t negate the reality that God Created. You may not want to participate in it, but you can not deny reality. Otherwise you become a nihilist. The Coptic, Syrian, Greek, Russian and Roman Catholics all acept the Virgin Mary and the existence of the soul and that it exists after death. The resurrection is when our bodies will be resurrected and remarried with our souls.
The Faith is an objective reality. Not up to us. Maybe something is difficult, ask God to help you believe as I will. The Faith was created 2000 years ago and enculturated into a particular culture. That is the Will of God. He wanted it that way. The criterion of Truth is consistency; the consistent teaching of the Church. That is the Truth; Truth being a “faithful representation of reality”.
21 REG // Dec 4, 2011 at 2:31 pm
“The Faith was created 2000 years ago and enculturated into a particular culture. That is the Will of God. He wanted it that way.” Perhaps your faith, Wheeler. I can’t speak for any of the the other commentators on this Blog; however, it is not mine. The God of Abraham, David and Jesus did not create the Godhood and religion of Plato and Augustine. Nor for that matter the God of Calvin and his like. Instead of wasting time reading Metaphysics which is like psychology a revisionary game; I would instead advise that you study the Bible for answers. Then it will become “Personal.” not metaphysical” Read the supposed “Fall” in chapter three; which, in reality is an admonishment not to pre-judge. Pre-judging is what Metaphysics is all about. Learn that the Bible is all about covenants, between people and people and God. In other words, high and lofty ideas will never equal a personal relationship with anyone. That’s the problem with Plato. If you ever really read him, you would see that besides being a pervert, he never developed a relationship based on mutual respect in any of his lectures.
By the way, this article the good doctor supplied is all about relationships, none Platonic. Yep, you’re right, I don’t like Plato.
22 David Yeagley // Dec 4, 2011 at 3:21 pm
Wheeler, every man has the right to choose to believe whatever he wants to believe. Right or wrong. Because belief is so completely personal, about that which is cosmic and eternal, we have what we call disputes, or arguments.
The words “belief” and “truth,” and even “God” mean different things to you than they mean to me. It is most difficult to have a conversation. I at least can identify an objective source for my beliefs, the Bible. How I believe is another matter, and subjective all over again.
I would be curious, however, if you had one shred of evidence that there is immediate life after death. No objective, rational, scientific mind has ever procured any such evidence. There is no soul. Mary is dead. That is the empirical evidence. What do you have beyond that? Personal, subjective, hearsay. Nothing more. If you say you have more evidence, I say you are not scientific or rational, after all. I admit to imagination, luck, chance, providence, and faith. Your trust in man confuses your frame of reference, at least to me.
I really take exception to your arrogance of superficial learning, insulting the host here, as if he’d never been to school. Your attitude is most offensive, but, I’m sure in your wondrous objectivity, you don’t see it. You’re innocent, as all who idolize the academic. Intellectual integrity trumps all measurement of behavior.
Let’s talk about your education. What have you studied–under the experience and direction of professional scholars? Do you have a degree? Let’s be really objective now.
23 Asaph // Dec 4, 2011 at 4:07 pm
“With the Greek language comes Greek concepts.
This is the plan of God.
Christianity enculturated Hellenism. Plato is in a sense the co-creator of Christianity. The New Testament is in Greek. Christianity grew up in Alexanderia, Antioch, Corinth, Ephesus.”
Historically there is a big difference between the Christianity developed at Antioch, and the apostasy which developed at Alexandria. Greek culture and pagan philosophy definitely influenced the church leaders there. Same as in Rome, ultimately. The once faithful church in Rome became a the harlot. Union of Church and State. Union of paganism with doctrines once pure. Corruption was the result. The papacy was the result.
24 JollyGreen // Dec 4, 2011 at 7:12 pm
Ecclesiastes 9:5: “For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten.”
“but the dead know not any thing.”
It seems to me that it would be hard to have a conscious existence without “knowing” anything.
Don’t want to offend anyone, but once good ole Digger O’dell, the Irish undertaker throws the dirt on top of your box, then you are going to be reduced to rot…..Mary the Mother of God included.
Mary was a good woman. She was favored by God. However, she had to trust in Christ for salvation like everyone else.
She is not a mediatrix. She does not have the “ear” of her Son, Jesus. No, like all others who have died, she is sleeping in the dust of the earth waiting for the resurrection.
She has no dispossessed soul or spirit that is hard at work making intercession for mankind.
She is DEAD! Gone….rotted away….nothing left.
The doctrine of the immortal soul is a tool of Satan to confuse the masses. I believe that ALL Marian apparitions are Satanically orchestrated.
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