David Yeagley is the great-great-grandson of Comanche leader Bad Eagle. 
Christian Tybring-Gjedde, member of the Norwegian Parliament, has publicly condemned multiculturalism, or, Muslim pandering. In a dramatically frank speak last May, he declared that Norwegian blonde girls are harassed into dying their hair dark, to avoid persecution. That says it all. He blames, not the Muslims, but the Norwegian Labor Party–the Communist, “liberal” party for their extremism in purposely allowing this cultural genocide of Norway, and denying any opportunity to resist it. In Orwellian terms, Tybring-Gjedde declared himself a “revolutionist.” He will resist the destruction of his own people and his own country.
Christian Tybring-Gjedde, fighting
for Norway, for his people, his nation,
and this culture.
Here is an excerpt from a classic speech he delivered recently, (together with the transcript:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=2G8ck20_qig
Dear National Congress,
The Labour Party has turned Oslo into an ethnically divided city.
In the Grorud Valley the indigenous population is moving out and non-Western immigrants are moving in. Norwegians feel ostracized in their own neighborhoods children don’t feel at ease in kindergartens, schools and leisure activities.No politicians should decide where people should live,
but the reason behind thousands of people deciding to move away is not something we politicians can just ignore.In the Grorud Valley blonde girls are harassed into dying their hair dark. Children are threatened with beatings if their lunch box contains salami. Boys of immigrant backgrounds threaten to beat Norwegian boys if they are not given extended playing time in football. Bags of sweets handed out at special occasions in kindergartens, are rifled through in search of gelatin. Such bags are marked with pictures of pigs, as a warning.
On Evenings and weekends cars are set on fire, windows smashed in at schools. This is not something Made up by a “mono-cultural” member of parliament like me it is part of everyday life in the multi-cultural Grorud Valley in Oslo.
One of the people who decided to move away is Patrick Åserud.
Patrick works in a kindergarten at Grorud, like his wife. Both resourceful people. But they can no longer stand the Labor Party’s demographic experiments. As Patrick told me: An ethnic and cultural self-annihilation is taking place, and worst of all, we are allowing it to happen. British historian Toynbee said “Civilizations die from suicide, not by murder” And that is exactly what is happening.The modern Western civilization based on: science, secularism, democracy, equal worth, equality, pluralism and freedom is gradually giving way to forces representing the opposite. The changes are applauded by the cultural relativists of the political elite, and academia and journalists, recruited from a one-sided radical environment.
We in the FRP (Norwegian Hard Right) have been accused of being extremist. Dear Congress defending our values of liberty without compromise is not extremist. What is extremist, is at all times caving in to special demands which undermine our own culture and the values our country is built on. And it is both radical and extremist to carry out immigration policies which in a matter of decades will make the indigenous population a minority in its own capital.
One of George Orwell’s many quotations says “The past was erased, the erasure was forgotten, the lie became truth.” “In times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act.” And dear National Congress: I will continue to be a revolutionary!
This is the same story in many Western countries. I heard it many times at the American Renaissance Conference last February. It was told by people like Filip Dewinter (Belgium), Dan Roodt (South Africa), and Adrian Davies (England). It is the intent of Islam to rule the world. “The womb is our greatest weapon,” said Muammar Gaddafi, that great general of excess and impropriety. And white, oedipal liberals of these Western countries are happy to see it. (American Renaissance has all the latest important news on these culture wars, and the ethnic cleansing planned for western, white countries.)
Muammar Gaddafi, Islamic visionary of denigration.
We all know, it is the American story, too. Everything that is American is under attack by the Communist, “liberal” Democrat traitors in Washington–and also in every local city council in the country. It is a social process–to destroy what exists. The alien, lying black African Communist Muslims traitor in the White House calls it “fundamental transformation.” His campaign slogan was “change.”
And so anyone who opposes the idea of being destroyed is called an extremist, a revolutionary, a radical. Of course, these are just words, but they are words which apply rather to the Communist, liberal Democrats. (Republicans may often follow their directives, in action, but at least most Republicans put up some kind of verbal resistance, meek as it is.)
Avi Lipkin says that massive depopulation of the Middle East is what is planned. Muslims are going to be immigrating to western countries as never before. This is what he said here in OKC, July 27, 2011. In other words, things will get much, much worse. But Lipkin says it’s all part of a globalist movement, and Islam is just one tool in the process of developing a one world government.
Be that as it may, patriots will stand for their own countries, and their own people. I am a member of the Comanche Nation. I am American Indian, but I identify with these struggling white conservative parties the world over. I believe American Indians have the right to preserve who and what we are, or what’s left of us. I merely extend the same right to every other ethnic groups, including all the white groups. I extend the same right to Jewish people. I know this offends many white conservative groups, because they often see Jews as a threat to the different white cultures in the world. I should like to recommend Ilana Mercer‘s work to these objectors, particularly her new book, Into the Cannibal’s Pot: Lessons from Post-Apartheid South Afrika. Mercer calls herself “Hebrew,” since she is not a practicing Jew, though her father is a rabbi.
By the way, Christian Tybring-Gjedde is a member of the Friends of Israel in the Parliament of Norway. And why not? Jewish nationalists certainly cannot object or oppose other peoples who wish to survive. True, the Jewish camp is divided, rather sharply these days. But, I do believe we’re passing the point where survival techniques of the diaspora, such as “tolerance,” are the norm for dominant ethnicities under siege. I’m thinking the majority of Jews these days understand that. Yes, there are a number of “romantics” still active and boisterous here in America, but, that’s because they’re in America. They can still prosper in their oppositions. They will learn, though. And their own conservative Jewish colleagues will teach them.
77 responses so far ↓
1 Asaph // Jul 31, 2011 at 2:11 pm
Now let us see how Tybring-Gjedde holds up as the comparisons to Breivik fall like acid rain all around him.
Is this a call to “war?”
2 David Yeagley // Jul 31, 2011 at 2:31 pm
It’s a call to common sense. European parliamentarians all over are saying the same thing. Their countries are failing. They are evolving into something else. That patriots don’t want to see that.
Are they wrong for not wanting to see that? What is your position Asaph. It is not clear. What is your position? If you have no stake in nationhood, these conversations are meaningless to you. If you don’t believe in nationhood, then you have no country.
There are people who believe in their nation, and who want to preserve it. It is very simple. If you don’t really believe in it, then perhaps you should make a distincf effort to distinguish yourself from the anti-nationalist, globalist powers, that actually want to desolve nationhood. If don’t believe in dissolving the nations, I think you should be clear about that. If you believe nations are ordained, then seems to me you should be willing to stand by one, or with one, to an extent you may not have shown here.
I’m saying that one who is not a globalist, yet who is also not a nationalist, must speak very clearly.
I for one believe in nationhood. I believe it is ordained of God. It is sacred, and not to be manipulate, denigrated, or trashed. It is to be preserved. Especially if it is a “free” nation.
That’s the next issue. What about “bad” nations? What needs to happen to them? Who’s to do it?
3 Asaph // Jul 31, 2011 at 2:51 pm
I know of one nation God ordained – Israel. Others have been begun by mankind from one purpose or another, mostly dominance of others. As stated elsewhere in the blogs, I believe Islam is a threat to any nation because of what Islam is – a union of church and state, and a pretty dark one at that. It is insidious because of its history, doctrines, and attitudes. It is overt in some nations. Covert in the West, save for big mouths who call for various types of overt actions.
If Gjedde is calling for common sense, fine. Perhaps he will inspire others in American positions of elected civil service to also state the obvious. THEN “war” as it projects itself in practical and literal ways will begin to take shape, because of what Islam is which it cannot forever hide in the West. Until THEN, I would just like to see the term “war” defined according to various articles and conventions and practices know to the modern age. You are never going to see “Christian” nations practicing heinous arts of killing which Islam performs on a daily basis. You may see people storm the streets and cry out for Muslims to return to their homelands.
Frankly, I believe the Papacy and Islam are arm in arm, and behind the scenes it’s all part of a grand scheme for globalist rule. Something I stand against, of course, as a Bible believing Christian. Freedom is freedom, regardless of where. But history has sown NOTHING can stop the gospel and persecution even propels it. So, in reality, my basic concern in these last couple of blogs is the attitude of violence I see projected towards “combatants of war” very ill-defined.
4 Thrasymachus // Jul 31, 2011 at 3:00 pm
“I know of one nation God ordained – Israel. Others have been begun by mankind from one purpose or another, mostly dominance of others.” — Asaph
This belief is the origin of antisemitism.
I strongly disagree. God ordained 70 original nations in the Book of Genesis. Israel was to be a “special” nation — but it was not to be the SOLE nation on the Earth.
Nations rise and fall according to their relationship with God:
“The wicked return to the grave, all the NATIONS that forget God.” — Psalm 9:17
God clearly deals with people on a national basis, not just on an individual one.
5 Asaph // Jul 31, 2011 at 3:04 pm
It should also be stated, for anyone who would know, believing as I do about the second beast of Revelation being the USA going bad, my thoughts of “nationhood” are colored. I am far more joined to the power of the Declaration and Constitution, their principles, and the writings of the Founders, than to “America” per se, which has been under attack by those who hate it long before Islam became an issue here. But as you know, I also believe there are powers at work so far away from the touch of ordinary man that nothing can be done to stop them, save for God. Thus, I see all of this in way which causes me to “look up, for [our] redemption draweth nigh.”
6 Asaph // Jul 31, 2011 at 3:06 pm
That is because nations exist. Now show us the list of the 70 nations God began.
Calling me antisemite is ignorant. Good grief.
7 Asaph // Jul 31, 2011 at 3:24 pm
The fact that God deals with nations (and He has a controversy with the nations soon to be finished) does not mean He started them. Perhaps I have missed a point of Scripture which declares otherwise.
8 Thrasymachus // Jul 31, 2011 at 3:26 pm
Asaph, sorry! I did not mean to say that you are an antisemite. (I never thought that for even a moment.) I only meant that the belief that Israel only is a nation ordained of God (and no other) is a belief that many people hold to — especially liberal Jew and their supporters (such as many a church pastor or priest) — that makes Gentiles feel resentment.
The Table of Nations can be found in Genesis chapters 10 and 11.
9 Thrasymachus // Jul 31, 2011 at 3:30 pm
“70 grandsons of Noah became the heads of all the nations of the world.”
Table of Nations
10 Asaph // Jul 31, 2011 at 3:44 pm
BTW, I believe Gjedde’s address to parliament was very good. Indeed, common sense.
Now, what is Norway to do about the cultural invaders?
11 Asaph // Jul 31, 2011 at 3:55 pm
Thras, I just read that section of Scripture a little while ago, and fail to see that God ordained any of those peoples into “nations,” which at that time, was not the same as nations we see today. Nonetheless, we have the beginning of Babel as “the gateway or portal to El, the Almighty, which God saw a an obvious threat to humanity and scattered the people by mixing up their languages. In fact, the people could have stood back and tried to get a handle on the situation, but terror overcame common sense.
The thing is, nations exist, so God deals with them, AND created His own to represent Him – Israel. I just do not see where God ordained any other nation than Israel. Now, Israel is not, in my understanding of Scripture, a chosen nation anymore. The ‘church in the wilderness’ has carried on in the body of Christ, as you and I and others have pointed out in these blogs, a kingdom not of this earth.
Which nations has God ordained in our day and age – post Calvary? No more than since the dawn of time. If God ordained any particular nations into existence which ones are they, by command, by opportunity, by law? Certainly not any Islamic nation. Nor Vatican State. He saw the development of America and the gospel has gone to more places from here than any other nation in history. That does not mean He authored the Constitution of the USA. Big difference how God will use nations. He even used Babylon to chastise Israel. He hardly can be seen as ordaining that ultra-pagan nation into existence.
12 Asaph // Jul 31, 2011 at 4:02 pm
Kelly’s list is historical (and for some quite questionable in some instances), but it is not a statement of God’s ordaining any of these nations into existence. They just did, completely apart from any direct command of Elohym.
13 Asaph // Jul 31, 2011 at 4:04 pm
“I for one believe in nationhood. I believe it is ordained of God. It is sacred, and not to be manipulate, denigrated, or trashed. It is to be preserved. Especially if it is a “free” nation. ”
I don’t know, David. Did not the white Euros pretty much manipulate, denigrate, and trash the Indian nations?
14 Asaph // Jul 31, 2011 at 4:08 pm
Yet you “believe” in the American nation, the conqueror. Seems to me the case being white Americans have given the American Indian a raw deal for a century and more, will God allow the American nation to eat some humble pie and be thrust to the dust?
If we say God ordained nationhood and it is sacred, betrayal of sacred trust will be the undoing of the USA.
15 Thrasymachus // Jul 31, 2011 at 4:08 pm
Asaph,
A NATION (natio in Latin = “birth”) is an extention of the family. A group of related families grows into a nation.
The pastor at my church speaks of Negroes and Whites together as “US,” and Jews as “THEM.” The only nations he recognizes as meaningful are Jews versus Gentiles (all of whom are lumped together). I deeply resent this.
If Jews are the only people granted the privilege of nation status in the Bible’s view of things, I’d just as soon change religions.
I LOVE my RACE! I do not want any race of people to become extinct, including my own.
Since the Bible declares that extinction is the fate of all wicked nations, I think that the intended dignity of a nation as a meaningful entity (= a group of related families, thus an extended family) in God’s sight can be inferred.
A good book to read from a scientific point of view is “On Genetic Interests” by Frank Salter.
16 Thrasymachus // Jul 31, 2011 at 4:11 pm
The modern United States is NOT a nation! It is an assemblage of peoples from all over the globe.
This is why there is a chance for Europe. The roots of nationhood still lie there. Europe may yet declare multiculturalism a huge failure and end the pactice.
17 Thrasymachus // Jul 31, 2011 at 4:19 pm
Israel was meant to be a blessing to the Gentile nations, not a solvent to dissolve them through forced race-mixing.
The Scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the Gentiles by faith, preached the gospel beforehand to Abraham, saying, “ALL THE NATIONS WILL BE BLESSED IN YOU.”
— Galatians 3:8
18 Thrasymachus // Jul 31, 2011 at 4:21 pm
In my view, Galatians 3:8 demonstrates that nationhood is something ordained of God and thus sacred.
19 Sioux // Jul 31, 2011 at 4:25 pm
Here is my theory: Christian Tybring-Gjedde is the real deal and what he is saying is resonating among his native countrymen, just as it would for any freedom loving patriiot, including those here in the US. Enter Breivik out of nowhere spouting all the same words in cut and paste manifesto and a new Facebook page. Could it be the latter is the “martyr” to help down the likes of the HARD RIGHT such as Christian TG? You can only get 21 years max for killing 100 people or kicking the dog. Mehinks that Breivik is a plant from the Left, and will be found insane and trotted off for a few months to a mental institution…and then spirited away never to be seen again.
20 Thrasymachus // Jul 31, 2011 at 4:26 pm
Again in Genesis 18:18 we read:
“Abraham will surely become a great and powerful nation, and all nations on earth will be blessed through him.”
The purpose of Abraham’s nation is contingent upon the existence of other nations. Israel was not to live in a vacuum. It was to be a light unto the nations. Nowhere does one find in the Scripture a divine call to abolish nationhood! Rather, it is said of the devil that he “weakens the natons.” We can see which direction the compass needle of Scripture points to — the respect of nations that are ordained of God.
21 WHEELER // Jul 31, 2011 at 4:26 pm
Asaph. America is NOT a nation. It is what is called a “propositional nation” which is an oxymoron. Meaning that America is based on “ideals”. As it says on the back of the dollar bill, it is a “Novus Ordo”.
Many of the FFofA were Masons. All were steeped in Enlightenment thought. The Enlightenment was a cultural revolution consisting of only Atheists. Most of the writings of the Enlightenment were done by Atheists. Baruch Spinoza was a huge influence but he was a materialist. Francis Fukuyama in his book “The Origins of the Political Order” demolished Locke and Rousseau who all stated that humans were all individuals. Locke is the basis of American political thought. He was wrong on his most cherished principle of man being an individual in the state of nature. Man was never an individual but always a member of a group.
See, Europe was the Old Order. America is a Masonic creation based on diversity and tolerance and equality, the Novus Ordo. It is a nihilist construct.
22 Asaph // Jul 31, 2011 at 5:57 pm
Wait a minute. Stop the music. Stop the music. Philosophy.
America is not a nation?
What is The United Nations? Not what it does.I’m not asking for a treatise on its corruption. What is the United Nations?
Saying America is not a nation is a philosophical position which has nothing to do with practical fact.
Thras, the term ‘nation’ in the Hebrew is ‘goy,’ a common term. Nothing really special about it.
23 Asaph // Jul 31, 2011 at 6:07 pm
All nations would be blessed in Abraham because of Messiah and faith.
Like I stated, nations exist, so God addresses them. That does not mean He founded any but Israel.
24 Asaph // Jul 31, 2011 at 6:08 pm
And what powerful nation did Abraham become?
25 Asaph // Jul 31, 2011 at 6:10 pm
BTW, my wife informed me that 21 years can be added on to extensively just by declaration of unfitness for release. Breivik is going to be in prison for a very long time.
26 Asaph // Jul 31, 2011 at 6:21 pm
It may be colloquial, but America DOES have a national motto, national song, national bird, national parks, and dozens of other “national” things, including “One nation under God.”
America is a nation begun by Brits. Of course the RCC believes otherwise: Columbus and all. That’s another subject.
27 Asaph // Jul 31, 2011 at 6:23 pm
“If Jews are the only people granted the privilege of nation status in the Bible’s view of things, I’d just as soon change religions.”
I did not state that, of course. I stated that Israel is the only nation started by God. Others in existence down through time were not.
28 Thrasymachus // Jul 31, 2011 at 6:40 pm
God made a covenant with Abraham. In all other ways (with the exception of Sarah giving birth in her old age, miraculously), the nation to come from Abraham was simply a biological fact of Nature, just like every other nation that has ever existed in history. The only thing special about Israel was the Covenant — and this was on account of Abraham’s faith. Indeed, God also promised Abraham that Ishmael would become a great nation.
In point of fact, God said that Esau also would become a nation — yet this nation was not favored in God’s sight.
All nations that come into existence must do so by God’s Providence. The rise and fall of nations is in the hands of the Creator.
At Babel, God showed His purpose in nationhood by confusing the speech of peoples to cause them to separate into what would become nation-states.
God does not address nations simply because they “happen” to exist and so He is thereby forced to deal with them. God ordained their existence, just as He ordained the existence of the institution of the family.
If Israel is the only nation that God ever “founded,” then what does that make the rest of us? Second-class human beings? Subhumans? Or are the rest of the nations simply social clubs, like the US is now rapidly becoming?
If the Hebrew term for nation is “goy,” then did God promise Abraham that he would become the father of many “goyim”? Was the word “goy” used of Israel?
29 Asaph // Jul 31, 2011 at 7:24 pm
As a matter of fact the term ‘goy’ IS used toward Abraham. As I said, just a common term.
No one would argue that God instituted families, which some ancient “nations” grew out of. That does not mean God established the existence of nations, ESPECIALLY when they all have turned against Him down through time. Bad enough Israel did.
In fact, YES, while Israel was in existence as Yah’s representatives the rest of the nations WERE basically second class, who needed to join themselves to Israel’s God, the path to salvation. Today, all who live by faith are Abraham’s seed and heirs according to the promise. All born again believers are Israel.
There is nothing America could ever do, as a nation, to have the same status Israel had. Many believe they still have it. I do not believe the Bible makes that claim for them anymore, nor any other nation.
The condition of the nations is a matter of choice on the part of its citizens. They can turn to God, they turn away from him, as all are doing. Sign of the times. Christ is returning soon.
30 Asaph // Jul 31, 2011 at 7:25 pm
I must reject the notion that all nations come into existence by God’s providence. His permission, perhaps. Not His providence.
31 Asaph // Jul 31, 2011 at 7:35 pm
BTW, Thras, if your take on Babel turning into nations is correct, it leaves the notion of families out of the process.
God scattered the people. What happened after that is up to them. matter of fact, reading the geneologies, if the term “nations” applies, it was a bunch of nations joining together to build the tower and God scattered the nations, He dismantled them. Nothing sacred about that.
32 Asaph // Jul 31, 2011 at 7:44 pm
Getting back on topic, I do hope Gjedde’s comments inspire people to stand up. Regardless of what anyone thinks about nationhood, Islam is threat to non-Muslims anywhere it goes.
33 Pamela K. // Jul 31, 2011 at 8:38 pm
Food For Thought
Norway & “The Oslo Syndrome”
http://rubinreports.blogspot.com/2011/07/oslo-syndrome-and-terror-attack-in.html
34 Thrasymachus // Jul 31, 2011 at 9:45 pm
“. . . it was a bunch of nations joining together to build the tower and God scattered the nations, He dismantled them. Nothing sacred about that.” — Asaph
Okay. This is more a matter of attitude than of fact.
I think that the decision on God’s part in separating the nations was very important. He did not want integration then and he does not want multiculturalism now. As someone posted earlier, multiculturalism is a return to Babel.
35 Thrasymachus // Jul 31, 2011 at 10:52 pm
“They will learn, though. And their own conservative Jewish colleagues will teach them.” — David Yeagley
Yes, I think there is much to hope for in this.
If Christians will put Jesus’ true teachings (as opposed to the traditions of men that have crept into the churches) into practice, and the West chooses a righteous stance in survival ideology, one could then be optimistic that the deep error of multiculturalism will become so clear that the whole practice, like communism, will come undone.
36 David Yeagley // Aug 1, 2011 at 7:43 am
The original command to humanity (Adam and Eve) was to multiply and to replenish (populate) the earth. That impetus, placed in man, accounts for the ‘spreading out’ of the human race over the globe. That would have happen regardless.
After the Flood, man showed a rebellion against this divine directive, and decided to congregate in one place. That’s where I would think גי (goy) would first apply, since root of the word implies an amassing (of persons). But, it is not used in the passage about Babel.
The first use is to Abram, and the making of him (his descendants) into a nation.
But the obvious connotation is language. At Babel, where men refused to “replenish the earth,” God intervened, and coerced His will. Through the strange phenomenon of language, God forced a separation of humanity into groups–not based on “family.”
Linguistic difference yeilded geographic difference, which in turn led to climatic, dietary, and probably genetic, micro-evolutionary variation.
I think “nation” (גי) did come to include these elements, after Babel: language, religion, border (geographic locale), culture/custom, etc.
I don’t believe God ordained evil, but the management of it is definitely His prerogative. Nationhood is one of His ways of managing humanity.
See: Deuteronomy 32:7-9, and Paul’s application, Acts 17: 26, 27. Paul says that the division of humanity into “nations” (plural of έθνος–nation) was to make it more likely that men would “find” God, or, seek an explanation, so to speak.
I think it is abundantly clear that God created the nations. We say God created the trees, the animals, etc. Variety is the contained potentiel in any life form. New species have come into being, and we still say God created them, even though they have evolved since the original forms.
37 Asaph // Aug 1, 2011 at 8:06 am
The very act of what God did at the Tower shows me that nations are not sacred, for God “mixed” the whole of humanity up right at that point. Various “nations,” tribes, what have you, pulled together to build that tower. God mixed their languages, irrespective of families, apparently, so that people gathered together who spoke the same and took off in terror. Now you have language being the mark of these new groups. But language changes constantly down through history. “Nations” have merged and changed through all kinds of various circumstances, and even today, at various borders, languages are not exclusive to those borders as people “mix.” There is nothing sacred about any of it that I can see.
If God uses nations to manage mankind that is not an argument that God began them, just because he told our first parents to be fruitful and multiply and replenish the earth.
Replenish just means “fill.” Fill the earth with more humans. There is nothing about borders, laws, culture or anything else in that mandate.
Nations exist. God uses them. But I must say, it is a stretch to say God ordained the earth to be composed of “nations,” which do nothing but war against each other, destroy His planet and His creatures. What, is this God’s way of population control? What about empires consuming entire nations?
God said, Fill the earth. He knew what would become of the human race, but His foreknowledge is not direct mandate. I am not a Calvinist.
38 Asaph // Aug 1, 2011 at 8:28 am
In Acts 17 Paul is stating that everything came from ONE human being, so we are all united, whether we “see” it or not. The nations are blind. They have to “feel” around for God as they blindly grope along looking for answers. There is nothing in this passage that produces evidence for God’s ordaining of nations to exist. Nothing sacred about it. If anything it shows the futility of it all.
God chose Abraham to start His nation, to represent Him among the nations. That nation continues in Christ, in faith, in spiritual Israel, in the body of Christ, His church, His called out ones. Good grief, the whole historic premise of His people is constantly being “called out” of the nations that existed. Abraham from Ur – Babylon, right down to God’s call to come out of Babylon at the end of time (Rev 14 & 18). Babylon is made up of three components – The Great Mother, her daughters, and the kings of the earth. Being a Protestant, I believe Scripture and history easily points to the RCC as being the Great Mother Whore. Her daughters are the churches who continue to practice “mother’s” doctriones, which she got by fornicating with the kings of the earth, which takes in all the other religions and cultures on the planet. And God calls HIS people out of it all to stand on the platform of eternal truth and become citizens of His kingdom, which is not of this world.
Paul used his Roman citizenship to get him to Rome, to be a witness. But Paul states nothing about the sacredness of boundaries, or man’s cultures, or laws, or languages. If anything, it has been in the way of the gospel since it all began.
Perhaps Wheeler is correct. America IS NOT a nation in the biblical/historic sense. It’s a melting pot of Earths peoples. And if that is the case, and prophecy predicts this nation will be the cause of papal dominance again, and the slide into final rebellion on the earth, the “sacredness” of this “nation” is a joke. It is now filled with corruption, sea to shining sea. It goes around the earth messing with borders, with cultures, with laws, with chicanery and outright criminal activity, while it lauds its past achievements at “humanitarian” activity. Sacred? Christian nation? Not.
39 Pamela K. // Aug 1, 2011 at 9:13 am
To be a member of a nation is a precious gift. It gives us a sense of belonging, a kinship with a particular people. The inability to identify ourselves as Americans, which is the purpose of multiculturalism, denies us our roots, our connection with the soil beneath our feet. It also leaves us exposed to manipulation by outsiders. In her books, “The Rage and The Pride” and “The Force Of Reason” Oriana Fallaci called Europe, “Eurabia” due to the spreading influence of Islam. She believed Islam murders the soul of a nation. Oriana was right. This recent outbreak of violence in Norway proves it.
Being a member of a nation and embracing the culture and cherished values of that nation often brings out the best in people. For instance, the amazing sacrifices made by our military men and women all over the world to protect American interests and promote the ideals of freedom. Yet, we have also seen how nationalism can become a curse. The best example of this in modern history is the rise of German Nationalism and Third Reich. Hitler had much in common with the Muslims today. He felt that there could be allegiance to no other nation except Germany and Nazism. The Muslims believe there can be no other allegiance except to Islam and the dictates of Sharia Law. Furthermore, there is always a designated people to be the scapegoat. With Hitler it was the Jews, for the Muslims, it is us.
In order not to repeat the past and allow unchecked nationalism is the reason why politically correct Europe and now, to a lesser degree, America, has succumb to the dictates of multiculturalism. Unfortunately, one extreme has led to another and the results, as we are witnessing, are tragic.
40 WHEELER // Aug 1, 2011 at 12:32 pm
As Thrasymachus has pointed out the basis of the word “nation” is the Latin word “natus” meaning ‘birth’. A nation is those who have a common ‘birth’. Each nation was started by a Patriarch. At Genesis 10.32, the Septuagint, it says, “These are the tribes of the sons of Noe, according to their generations, according to their nations: of them were the islands of the Gentiles scattered over the earth after the flood”.
Clearly nations existed before the Tower of Babel and this verse precedes the story thereof.
In the use of the laws of nature, one can see that nations are in accordance with them. Globalization, or The Tower of Babel, or Internationalism can also be declared to be evil solely on the basis of the laws of nature.
One of the laws of nature is the Golden Mean. The Greek Orthodox theologian Apostolos Makrakis makes this point about the Christian Godhead. The Trinity is the Golden Mean between the extremes of strict Semitic monotheism and the polytheism of the rest of the people of the earth.
Jesus Christ is the Golden Mean for He is both God and Man; where the extremes meet.
The Golden Mean is the mean between the extremes or “where the extremes meet”. The Golden Mean exists throughout the Cosmos. At every level of reality the Golden Mean exists.
All Virtue exists in the Golden Mean. Courage, a virtue, exists between the extreme of Rashness, a vice and the deficiency of Cowardice, another vice.
Internationalism seeks to bring all men into one group. That is an extreme. To be just an ‘individual’ is also an extreme; it is a deficiency. Between the Extreme and the Deficiency lies the Golden Mean.
Race, Nation, Tribe, clan, is the Golden Mean between the extreme of One Group and the deficiency of Individualism. Therefore, since race and nation exist in the Golden Mean, it is the making of God and has the sanction of God.
Furthermore, Family is the paradigm of the Cosmos. Family is very important. The Roman Catholic Church sanctifies this concept by naming Joseph, Mary, and Jesus as “The Holy Family”. What is the Trinity but a ‘typos’ of the Family; a type of family.
As family is important, race is as well. Race is one large extended Family. Race is a connection of inter-related families, headed by the Royal Family.
See, globalization and the bringing all people into One Group fits Jewish Theology. The basis of Jewish Theology is that God is One. It brokers no hierarchy, no differentiation. The concept of the Hebrews of God is one of Monism. In the Enlightenment, the “Atomism” of Democritus was matched with the Monism of the Hebrew Old Testament! They thought that “Atomism” was a Law of Nature. But with modern science, the Atom itself is divided into three parts—–just like the Christian God. What drives Globalization and the destruction of race is Jewish theology of One God. If God is One, Mankind must be One. But if God is divided like what Christian revelation teaches, then, Mankind must also be differentiated into tribes, clans, races and nations.
The Laws of Nature agree, or back up the teachings found in the Bible.
41 WHEELER // Aug 1, 2011 at 12:42 pm
As Asaph rightly points out that race and nation does cause Strife.
Strife is a Law of Nature. This world is made, **purposely**, with Strife. The Greeks noticed this. “Life is War”.
In Tikkun Olam, “fixing the World”, Jews think that they are to “remake” the world and “fix it”. This means that they will take out “Strife” from the World.
Socialism is about Peace. Peace is to be achieved at all costs. Socialists believe in that the World is to be “peaceful”. In that case, Nation and Race must be ended. This Peace drive is behind the de-racination process.
All nations, races, like the insects and animals in this world, have “volkenhass”. In order to “cure anti-semitism”, the Jew must fix the world with “tolerance” and “diversity”, so that he may no longer feel the sting of volkenhass.
The whole world, the liberal agenda, is fixing the world for the sake of the Jew. We are not allowed to discriminate, hence 90 year old European women are being patted down at airports less we “racially profile”. We are going to “fix the world”. And the Holocaust is a tool to beat down anybody that says otherwise.
All this really is driven by a hatred of the true Triune God and the Reality He created, and hatred of the Logos.
42 Thrasymachus // Aug 1, 2011 at 1:44 pm
The Bible does not say that the nations were arbitrary and irrespective of family. Quite to the contrary:
Genesis 10
The Table of Nations
1 This is the account of Shem, Ham and Japheth, Noah’s sons, who themselves had sons after the flood.
The Japhethites
2 The sons[a] of Japheth:
Gomer, Magog, Madai, Javan, Tubal, Meshek and Tiras.
3 The sons of Gomer:
Ashkenaz, Riphath and Togarmah.
4 The sons of Javan:
Elishah, Tarshish, the Kittites and the Rodanites.[b] 5 (From these the maritime peoples spread out into their territories by their clans within their nations, each with its own language.)
The Hamites
6 The sons of Ham:
Cush, Egypt, Put and Canaan.
7 The sons of Cush:
Seba, Havilah, Sabtah, Raamah and Sabteka.
The sons of Raamah:
Sheba and Dedan.
8 Cush was the father[c] of Nimrod, who became a mighty warrior on the earth. 9 He was a mighty hunter before the LORD; that is why it is said, “Like Nimrod, a mighty hunter before the LORD.” 10 The first centers of his kingdom were Babylon, Uruk, Akkad and Kalneh, in[d] Shinar.[e] 11 From that land he went to Assyria, where he built Nineveh, Rehoboth Ir,[f] Calah 12 and Resen, which is between Nineveh and Calah—which is the great city.
13 Egypt was the father of
the Ludites, Anamites, Lehabites, Naphtuhites, 14 Pathrusites, Kasluhites (from whom the Philistines came) and Caphtorites.
15 Canaan was the father of
Sidon his firstborn,[g] and of the Hittites, 16 Jebusites, Amorites, Girgashites, 17 Hivites, Arkites, Sinites, 18 Arvadites, Zemarites and Hamathites.
Later the Canaanite clans scattered 19 and the borders of Canaan reached from Sidon toward Gerar as far as Gaza, and then toward Sodom, Gomorrah, Admah and Zeboyim, as far as Lasha.
20 These are the sons of Ham by their clans and languages, in their territories and nations.
The Semites
21 Sons were also born to Shem, whose older brother was[h] Japheth; Shem was the ancestor of all the sons of Eber.
22 The sons of Shem:
Elam, Ashur, Arphaxad, Lud and Aram.
23 The sons of Aram:
Uz, Hul, Gether and Meshek.[i]
24 Arphaxad was the father of[j] Shelah,
and Shelah the father of Eber.
25 Two sons were born to Eber:
One was named Peleg,[k] because in his time the earth was divided; his brother was named Joktan.
26 Joktan was the father of
Almodad, Sheleph, Hazarmaveth, Jerah, 27 Hadoram, Uzal, Diklah, 28 Obal, Abimael, Sheba, 29 Ophir, Havilah and Jobab. All these were sons of Joktan.
30 The region where they lived stretched from Mesha toward Sephar, in the eastern hill country.
31 These are the sons of Shem by their clans and languages, in their territories and nations.
32 These are the clans of Noah’s sons, according to their lines of descent, within their nations. From these the nations spread out over the earth after the flood.
43 Asaph // Aug 1, 2011 at 1:45 pm
Wheeler, if I may ask. What is your religious/political/philosophical stripe?
44 Thrasymachus // Aug 1, 2011 at 1:52 pm
WHEELER: Your post #40 is spot on. All extremes are to be avoided and the Laws of Nature are to be obeyed. The forced integration and resultant loss of racial identity and nationhood are leading the world into a new Dark Ages.
Israel was never selected as a mere end unto herself. As God’s people and exemplary nation, she was to be a blessing to the nations — something God had made provision for in His Plan.
45 WHEELER // Aug 1, 2011 at 1:55 pm
I was raised Roman Catholic and I went to both Roman Catholic and Greek Orthodox churches for the longest time. I follow the teachings of the one holy catholic (universal) Church.
Politically, I’m a Royalist, a Monarchist. I uphold and defend the Old Order.
Philosophically, well, Philosophy literally means to be a “lover of wisdom”. I hope I am that. This wisdom is what built the Natural Order. This is what the ancient Greek called the Laws of Nature.
I follow the Logos of Divine Revelation and the Logos of the Natural Order as a philo-sophier; a lover of Wisdom. The Roman Catholic Church teaches from both, Holy Tradition and the Natural Law. According to the Septuagint, Wisdom is the knowledge of Divine and human things and their causes, living in a life of rectitude. Wisdom is a two part harmony; which harmony is a Law of Nature. And so the Catholic Church teachings follow the methodology of harmony, a two part harmony between Divine Revelation (holy tradition) and the Laws of Nature (or natural law).
46 Thrasymachus // Aug 1, 2011 at 1:59 pm
“World Peace” has always been the battle cry of the Liberal! (We Want World Peace Organization
“Imagine there’s no countries
It isn’t hard to do
Nothing to kill or die for
And no religion too
Imagine all the people
Living life in peace…
– John Lennon
The Bible even warns us against this.
47 Thrasymachus // Aug 1, 2011 at 2:02 pm
But the Bible says that “world peace” cannot be accomplished by the Liberals:
“And ye shall hear of wars and rumours of wars: see that ye be not troubled: for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet.” — Matthew 24:6
48 Thrasymachus // Aug 1, 2011 at 2:07 pm
What the Bible teaches is that racial integration and multiculturalism multiplies the factors and potential for evil in the world, whereas nationhood and separate places for separate peoples minimizes these.
World Unity and World Government make possible the utmost evil and Rebellion against God.
49 David Yeagley // Aug 1, 2011 at 3:49 pm
Asaph: God “mixed” the whole of humanity up right at that point. Various “nations,” tribes, what have you, pulled together to build that tower.
I beg to differ. There were no “nations” before Babel. (Remember that Abram was long after Babel. Babel was humanity immediately after the flood, while still one “family,” one language, etc. They had not spread out. They weren’t “pulled together.”
Now, the other element we haven’t mentioned regarding race (which is slightly different from “nation) is the matter of Noah’s three sons, Shem, Japeth, and Ham. As history seems to testify, (and most traditional evolutionists concur), this is an expression of the Caucasoid, the Mongoloid, and the Negroid, respectively–the white, “yellow,” and black. (They say American Indians are of the Mongoloid group.)
Noah’s sons has to be incorporated into the Babel language process, too.
“Birds of a feather glock together.” That seems to be a basic law of nature. When you mix people together, however, they generally have interracial sexual relations, and mixing of races and ethnicities. I suppose you could say it’s true for dogs, too. Maybe cats. Maybe horses.
50 David Yeagley // Aug 1, 2011 at 3:53 pm
When Paul says “made of one blood,” he is not addressing the some dreamed up liberal tenet of ethnic transcendence, some doctrine of necessary interracial mixing. That’s how Acts 17 is generally used, but it is near blasphemous abuse, in my opinion.
Paul is being somewhat Platonic here. It is the idea that God separated man into pieces, so, each group looking at the other, noting the differences, might wonder where they all came from. Cognitive dissonance inspires resolution, so that man might “haply” seek after God and find him.
Like, separating two fighting brothers, putting them in separate corners. They might be lucky enough to think of the fact that they both came from the same father…
51 David Yeagley // Aug 1, 2011 at 4:00 pm
I might also add, or re-quote, God “divided to the nations their inheritance when he separated the sons of Adam, He set the bounds of the people.” (Deut. 32: 8). Paul (who I doubt used the Septuagint) puts it that God “hath determined the times before appointed, and the bounds of their habition.” Acts 17:26
I don’t know how these matter can be more clear. God created the nations. I’m perhaps they are not “sacred,” but, they are of divine origin. They may not be “holy,” but, they are ordained. I’d say one must be mighty careful when manipulating what was ordained.
Always, man tries to separate what God hath joined together, and man tries to bring together that which God hath separated.
52 David Yeagley // Aug 1, 2011 at 4:01 pm
I’m not saying it is a sin to intermarry. I’m saying that nationhood is not to be disrespected and ignored.
53 Thrasymachus // Aug 1, 2011 at 4:09 pm
Is intermarriage a sin?
My view is this:
An individual case — perhaps not.
On a nation-wide scale — perhaps so.
All the enemy Palestinian nations of Ancient Israel apparently no longer exist. The Philistines, the arch-enemy, are a good example. The Philistines practiced intermarriage, and, in this way, walked off the stage of World History as a distinct nation.
At one time, this view below was much more common that it is today:
Muhammad Ali on Integration (and what it really means).
54 Pamela K. // Aug 1, 2011 at 4:28 pm
“and He made from one common origin all nations of men to settle on the face of the earth…Acts 17:26 In some modern Bibles this translates as “Hath made of one blood”, however, in some older manuscripts, the word, blood, is omitted from the text.
“He hath made of one (meaning Adam) all nations of men…and hath determined the times before appointed.” Again earlier manuscripts read “the appointed times” that is, the times appointed by God’s providence on which the several families of the earth (several meaning three or more) should go to those countries where God in His wisdom designated for them to dwell.
“And the bounds of their habitation…” here Paul is speaking of every family being appointed to a particular place, that they might grow and prosper in the place where God designated to them. Every nation has a place which has been appointed by their Creator, as sure as the Israelites were given the land of Canaan.
However, there is absolutely no law in the Bible prohibiting marriage between people of different races. God did not want the Israelites to intermarry with other pagan cultures surrounding them.
The Bible does say that people should not become “unequally yoked”. Again, this does not have anything to do with race, but religious beliefs. For instance, a Christian woman should not marry a Muslim man, because she then places herself under the yoke, or burden of Islam.
55 David Yeagley // Aug 1, 2011 at 4:33 pm
Psalm 87: 5, 6
And of Zion it shall be said, This and that man was born in her: and the highest Himself shall establish her. The Lord shall count, when he writeth up the people, that this man was born there.
It sounds like God takes into consideration all the circumstances of one’s birth…
These things are very deep.
56 Pamela K. // Aug 1, 2011 at 4:43 pm
Psalm 87: 5, 6
“And of Zion it shall be said, This and that man was born in her: and the highest Himself shall establish her. The Lord shall count, when he writeth up the people, that this man was born there.”
I have always believed this to mean that when God takes into account professing Christians, He will set apart those for the inhabitants of the New Jerusalem, His children born again through their belief in Christ as the Messiah, the New Jerusalem meaning Heaven.
57 Thrasymachus // Aug 1, 2011 at 4:48 pm
““And the bounds of their habitation…” here Paul is speaking of every family being appointed to a particular place, that they might grow and prosper in the place where God designated to them.”
No, the antecedent here is NATIONS. No mention of the family unit here. The nations have their boundaries ordained by God.
There is no sadder fact today than the integration of precious white children with Negro children. It causes me to cry bitter tears. These beautiful young Whites have no identity as a race or people and will simply intermarry freely with the Blacks until the future of the Whites is in jeopardy.
I instantly feel a bond of blood-ties with any white child and no such stong bond with any black child. I have natural human compassion for any black child, to be sure, but not a kinship blood-tie.
58 Pamela K. // Aug 1, 2011 at 4:58 pm
Wow! I guess even God Himself can be contradicted on this website!
“And I will bless thee who bless you, who confer prosperity or happiness upon you and curse him who curses or uses insolent language towards you; in you will ALL THE FAMILIES AND KINDRED OF THE EARTH be blessed and by you they will bless themselves.” Genesis 12:3
59 Thrasymachus // Aug 1, 2011 at 4:59 pm
To put it another way:
Every white child out there today is my “little white brother or sister.” No black child is such.
But white children are no longer being “raised white.” They do not think of me as their racial kinsman. My culture — Beethoven, Bach, Rameau, Shakespeare — is being changed into . . . well, just name any black “rap artist” of your choice.
My future in racial and cultural terms is being wiped out by the politics of the day.
As Aldous Huxley said, (these are close to his words, though perhaps not precise): “Expose a person over and over to the same temptation, and, sooner or later, he is likely to give in to it.”
60 Thrasymachus // Aug 1, 2011 at 5:02 pm
I believe that God recognizes indivituals, families, clans, tribes, nations, and the entire world. God deals with human beings on all these levels. When speaking of Abraham, my Bible says that all the NATIONS of the Earth will be blessed in him. A nation is a (usually) very large group of related families.
61 Thrasymachus // Aug 1, 2011 at 5:03 pm
The “tempation” I had in mind in post #59 was, of course (in this context), miscegenation.
62 Thrasymachus // Aug 1, 2011 at 5:18 pm
A cultural gem from European soil: Ludwig van Beethoven — Violin Sonata Op. 12 No. 3 in E flat Major
63 Thrasymachus // Aug 1, 2011 at 6:43 pm
Even Moses could not keep his hands raised indefinitely.
The strongest man — however strong — will eventually become weary and worn out. All return to the dust in the end.
The White Race in America is worn out from the endless racial struggle. The endless political pressure to integrate with Negroes and the ceaseless aggressive encouragement of racial intermarriage is now winning out. This whole problem could have been avoided, had the first Whites simply done their own manual labor and wisely refused to import African slaves.
Yes, it is the LOVE of money that is the ultimate cause of all this. If people loved their racial brothers and sisters more than they love money, this could never have come upon us.
But England’s King John murdered his own nephew, Arthur Plantagenet, because his ambition was greater than his love for his own family. The love of money is indeed the root of all evil.
64 Thrasymachus // Aug 1, 2011 at 6:52 pm
Arthur Plantagenet was remembered in Shakespeare’s play “(The Life and Death of) King John.”
65 David Yeagley // Aug 1, 2011 at 8:51 pm
Looks like we all have different “shades” of view on this matter.
I know that real Indians would rather die Indian than live as something else. Look at us. That’s exactly what we’re doing, and have done, since the wars were ended.
We’re very plagued by intermarriage. Our “democrat” leaders know they’ll get more government money if there are more “numbers” in the tribal population. So they lower the blood quantum, to have more people. The result? We have LESS INDIANS.
66 Pamela K. // Aug 1, 2011 at 9:56 pm
“We’re very plagued by intermarriage. Our “democrat” leaders know they’ll get more government money if there are more “numbers” in the tribal population. So they lower the blood quantum, to have more people. The result? We have LESS INDIANS.”-David Yeagley
Yeah well, nobody is putting Indians under Chinese water torture either! Marriage isn’t “a plague.” Like everything else, it is a choice. And most of the time it is a choice made because two people fell in love not because they’re trying to destroy a race.
How can you honestly feel this way when you are a child of intermarriage yourself?
67 Thrasymachus // Aug 1, 2011 at 10:35 pm
Honest psychologists will tell you that it is now known that people are virtually born with racial awareness. Little babies recognize racial differences.
These racial instincts, when not indoctrinated against, cause a person to tend to prefer his or her own group and also to be wary of outsiders. When a person finds his ethnic or racial group under attack — especially the threat of extinction — these racial feelings can then rise to a heightened level and overpower more self-oriented interests.
As Muhammad Ali said, “It’s natural to want to be with your own.” The psychologists are now finding out in laboratory that this is indeed how we are made.
68 Thrasymachus // Aug 1, 2011 at 10:49 pm
In Genesis Chapter 17 we read:
“18 And Abraham said unto God, O that Ishmael might live before thee!
19 And God said, Sarah thy wife shall bear thee a son indeed; and thou shalt call his name Isaac: and I will establish my covenant with him for an everlasting covenant, and with his seed after him.
20 And as for Ishmael, I have heard thee: Behold, I have blessed him, and will make him fruitful, and will multiply him exceedingly; twelve princes shall he beget, and I will make him a great nation.
21 But my covenant will I establish with Isaac, which Sarah shall bear unto thee at this set time in the next year.
22 And he left off talking with him, and God went up from Abraham.”
God chose one line of descent over another, though both were from Abraham.
In this passage, God seems (to me, at least) to be honoring Abraham’s natural racial instincts. Inasmuch as this Original Covenant is obviously based on one man and one woman’s bloodline (Abraham’s legitimate seed), God’s promised reward to faithful Abraham is a sign that love of race is recognized and approved of by the Lord.
69 Thrasymachus // Aug 1, 2011 at 10:54 pm
The Bible makes allowance for a limited amount of intermarriage, and these are always exceptions, not the rule. It is when the extent of the practice becomes great enough to threaten the ethnic group with extinction that a problem arises.
70 Asaph // Aug 2, 2011 at 5:44 am
I must disagree with the notion the earth had no “nations” before the Tower. The entire “earth” spoke one language. The number of people in that population at that time was easily numbering enough to begin city-states of tribes, “nations.” The size of the populations motivated people to keep branching out, hence, “as they journeyed east.” No one here is going to try and say one family attempted to build this tower. That is ridiculous.
Also, considering the merits of the arguments placed by David on his site from his personal perspectives of life, I believe it is incumbent upon you, my brother, to answer PK’s question above:
“How can you honestly feel this way when you are a child of intermarriage yourself?”#66
71 Asaph // Aug 2, 2011 at 5:59 am
“A nation is a (usually) very large group of related families.” #60
If this IS the true definition, then America IS NOT a nation, and never has been. Nor is Canada, nor is anything on the Australian continent, and elsewhere on the globe.THIS is why I must take the position I have against the notion God established the “nations.” ONE couple produced the planet’s population. That population, however it decides to engage itself – empire to simple people in the bush, are composed of individuals precious to God. And those simple bushmen are no less important to the plan of salvation as they witness to others. In some of these cases these people have “kings.” They are hardly in a position to wage a war against anything else on the planet. Are they nations?
This entire discussion about nations is becoming more and more obvious to me. It is does not have the importance being placed upon it. Matter of fact, it is obviously a show of incredible ego and self-importance. I believe the Scriptures have been twisted to proclaim an erroneous position which means little to nothing to the plan of salvation, which is God’s highest order of concern.
If Norway became Islamic, if all of Europe became Islamic, such would place humanity under no real different circumstances than at other times of conquer and conquest down through time. S–t happens. Always has, always will, because of sin. Nations or no nations, someone is always looking to dominate someone else, because that is the battle with evil started in heaven.
Nations exist, only to rise and fall, which is on the horizon for America, whether from Muslim conquest or sheer stupidity or subterfuge of its elected civil servants. If God ordained the nations, let us see if He steps in and saves this one.
72 Asaph // Aug 2, 2011 at 7:07 am
Much like this thread, after looking at the news today (and daily for unfortunate years) I am assured the world at large stands in total disagreement, with no solutions for anything on anything that anyone will agree upon. Such shall it be in the days before Christ returns. Confusion. Mass confusion.
Nations. Yeah. Big deal.
73 Pamela K. // Aug 2, 2011 at 8:36 am
“Nations exist, only to rise and fall, which is on the horizon for America, whether from Muslim conquest or sheer stupidity or subterfuge of its elected civil servants. If God ordained the nations, let us see if He steps in and saves this one.” – Asaph
Although God will never forsake His precious children here, we must accept the grim reality that America is going to fall. I believe that God has done more for the United States of America than any other nation on the face of the earth, including Israel, in regards to our immense prosperity, but far more importantly, with our freedom. True freedom can come only from God and deep reverence for Him. Our Founding Fathers knew this all too well, clearly seeing the hand of Providence in the winning of our independence during the Revolutionary War. This is why they chose the Bible, not the Quran, to lay the foundations of our government. However, today’s leadership has forsaken God. They turn a blind eye and a deaf ear to the ACLU and other atheist groups constantly trying to remove any and all symbols of Jesus Christ from our society and yet, because of selfishness and greed, are allowing wealthy Muslims to come here and influence our political and educational systems and appease their demands that we conform to the dictates of Sharia Law. However, the Muslims are only a part of the problem. I believe the worst persecution for true believers will come from those in the guise of Christ Himself, members of the emerging Harlot, or Apostate Church, “the tares” among the wheat.
74 David Yeagley // Aug 2, 2011 at 10:12 am
It isn’t a “notion,” Asaph. The word גי (“goy,” if you can read this detestable new Word version of modern Hebrew lettering to represent the ancient Hebrew…) does not appear before Abram. That’s the scriptural fact. Humanity is not a “nation” before Babel. Nationhood is something that developed after Babel, for reasons afore stated.
You don’t have to accept it, like it, or even believe it. It’s just a scriptural fact. God created the nations, and also declares that He rules over them. It isn’t just a matter of man’s prowess or revolutions.
Nations are like moral incubators. Testing fields. I’ve preached for 10 years now the idea of “national probation.” Nations come and go as they relate to the will of God, particularly and originally in terms of how they related to ancient Israel, or, the Law of God. Today, I’m sure it has more to do with how nations relate to Christianity, the modern version of ancient Israeli morals and social values.
Perhaps I have over stated the case, a tad bit. But, to write nationhood off as insignificant is to defy God’s mechanism for the sacred “didactic” exercise of informing humanity. Nationhood is a means to an end. That’s all.
75 David Yeagley // Aug 2, 2011 at 10:15 am
Pamela, I don’t despise my parents for their marriage. Nor do I have to idolize it, or imitate it. It is no dishonor to parents to think you might do better, or that you might base your decisions for marriage on a different foundation than personal love.
There must be personal love, of course, but, why cannot that that occur within one’s own race or ethnicity? Why is that so terribly taboo? to control one’s selection.
This other kind of love is Medieval, or I should say, Elizabethan. Maybe purely romantic and self-centered. I say, include the greater picture, the nation. Then get “romantic.”
76 David Yeagley // Aug 2, 2011 at 10:17 am
And American was a normal nation, like the others, in the beginning. White, Anglo-Saxon Protestant. Plain and simple. The rest are add-ons.
I remember observing before my classes at OSU-OKC, toward the end, “America today is certainly unlike any other nation that ever existed. Certainly unique.”
But for these very reasons, it is declining, I do believe.
77 Pamela K. // Aug 2, 2011 at 11:33 am
David,
Your response brings to my mind the Book of Ruth. Not only is it a beautiful prophecy, an illustration of the entrance of the heathen world into the Kingdom of God, of Ruth’s willingness to leave her own people of Moab, a wanton people of idolatry and sin, to follow after her mother-in-law, Naomi, a faithful Israelite, who had already accepted the interreligious and perhaps interracial union between her son and Ruth.
“And Ruth said,
“Urge me not to leave you or turn back from following you; for where you go I will go, and where you lodge I will lodge. Your people shall be my people and your God my God.” Ruth 1:16
The mere conduct of a righteous woman, Naomi, and her willing acceptance and love for her daughter-in-law brought forth this beautiful confession of God from Ruth.
And then, later on in the story, we see Boaz relationship with Ruth, and how he sought to protect her as she gleaned in his fields. Their union would bring about Obed, the father of Jesse, who would become the father of David, King of Israel and an ancestor of Jesus Christ.
This has always been one of my favorite stories in all of the Bible and every time I read it, this story brings to mind the beautiful passage from Romans 8:28,
“For all things work together for those who love God and are called according to His purpose.”
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